The rooms still echo

Kayleen, what is up? Not much.

What is up with you? OK, guys, we're awkward on the

introductions. We've been on the phone for like

a long time now. And then starting this.

So yeah, didn't know how to start that one, I'm not going to

lie. No, no, you're good.

You're good. But Killing just got some good

advice for her other platforms that she does, so that's cool.

Yeah, like really good advice. I'm excited.

Honestly, definitely for you killing, because you're

definitely more involved with that side of things.

I just come to talk, yeah. I like, no, no, like maybe like,

I don't know, it just, I really needed to hear it.

I know, isn't it crazy how someone can just tell you

something out of the blue and it gives you like this immense

amount of hope to just keep doing something?

Yeah, yeah, it does honestly great advice and like, honestly

good motivation. It like literally motivated the

heck out of me. Like I'm telling you like.

I have no doubt that once we finish this, you're going to be

on YouTube. Hopefully.

During the podcast. Yeah, I'll do that.

Yes, for sure. I'll do that too because I, I

need AI, need to make a YouTube channel so I can put the stuff

on like all of our podcast on there or all of our episodes.

On there. I think that's a good idea.

So anyone who's listening, we are going to have that platform

coming as well. So if you don't have Spotify, we

have it on Spotify and Apple currently.

Yes. So, Kaylene, what?

What? And we'll and we'll be on

YouTube very shortly. 2.52.5 OK 2.22222 point 52.5 OK Anyways,

so in the last episode we left off talking about what happened

behind the scenes and some situations in our life kind of

going more in detail with that. I think it's a podcast is going

killing. Like we're definitely starting

to like feel more comfortable. Yeah, for sure.

I think the same thing. Yeah, yeah.

When I listen back to the episodes, I feel like you always

agree with me. You're like, yeah, yeah, for

sure, yeah. Well, you say a lot of

knowledgeable things. I'm not panicking.

YouTube page No. Yeah, for sure, you should too.

I know, I don't know, maybe. I think you'd be good at it.

Maybe a lot of people would like.

You I can post about Drake I guess.

Yeah, or just post the videos from your Facebook to YouTube as

well some. Good videos on there.

Yeah, you do. Yeah.

You like that? Yeah, yes.

So. Yeah.

Like I said last time, we kind of talked about behind the

scenes kind of things, so we're going to go a little more in

detail with that in regards to where we're at now and if we

could go back. I know we're like sharing in

increments. There's just so much so healing,

like something you shared was the driving scenario when you

and Oh my gosh, here we go when you and you toothpaste had

gotten pulled over. Right.

So in that moment, like if you don't mind me asking on this,

how did you feel on that moment? Or did you just feel like, oh,

this is what life is? I just mostly felt like this is

what life is and honestly was like anything I could do do

while I was there to help, like that's what I wanted to do was

just be there and help and you know, just any way that I could.

And at that, in that time in my life, majority of the reason why

I chose to live there and why I had stayed back to was that that

reason of wanting to feel like they're for there for them and

that they had somebody, they weren't alone.

And if they needed help, I was there to help.

So I feel like that was one of the situations where I was like

able, able to help and I felt like needed in a way like, you

know, and I. Kind of asked another question.

Yeah, you're like, no. Just no, no, no, no.

So you're good. I kind of just want to ask in

regards to that, just kind of flipping the script a little

bit, did you feel like you had anybody to help you and did you

feel alone while you were in that?

Did you on the flip side of it, like what was your stance

looking back? I was safe for a very long time.

Sorry I interrupted you. Did you feel like you had anyone

to call? OK, go ahead.

No, you're good. And that moment not, not

necessarily, but as time progressed, I realized like,

because we were there for each other.

And so as time progressed, I realized like, I'm getting older

now and you know, you can't for one change somebody.

You can only be there to help. So I didn't feel lonely in that

moment. But eventually at, like I said,

as you know, as time progressed, I felt more and more lonely in a

way. But I feel like we were like, I

feel like we were more like best friends.

And so, you know, the older I had, I had gotten, I realized,

you know, yeah, like, sometimes just people in situations aren't

going to change. And that's whenever I started to

feel more lonely because I feel like for so long I was trying to

help and change. Not that anybody needs changing,

just the situation, you know, because I wanted them there.

But it eventually made me feel a little lonely in the end because

whenever I was an adult or becoming an adult, like, you

know, I just felt this need in the back of my mind, like I

didn't know I, I worried about them a lot.

And then if I didn't know where they were, like kind of like a

parent in a sense, but you know, like just worrying a lot, like

just, I hope they're OK. Like, I don't know if, if they

need me or, you know, so I felt more worried than anything.

And then you know. Like did it almost feel like

your purpose in that season was to be there as AI would describe

it in a sense of like a step stool?

Like did you feel like you were kind of in a position where if

you left, this person wouldn't have been able to reach the top

of the cabinet? Does that make sense?

Just as an example. That makes sense.

Like, did you kind of feel that way or do you think that's kind

of out of bounds? I feel like in my head that

there were so many people Downing on this person and I

felt like if they felt loved by at least one person that they

wouldn't feel alone. But I was kind of tearing myself

piece by piece a little bit along the way.

And then when I finally realized and it hit me like you can't

change somebody that doesn't want to be changed, regardless

how much you love them and care for them.

And I think that realize realization kind of hit pretty

hard. And I was like, you know, you

can love somebody and you can be there for him and you can try

everything that you can do, but you can't, you can't change

somebody that doesn't want to be changed.

And, and regardless of what you do and how much you love

somebody, it doesn't mean that they don't love you, they love

you. Some people just don't know how

to change, whether you know, it's addiction, drinking, you

know, stuff like that. It it's just like one of those

things that it they have got to want it for themselves.

And you know, if, if they don't want that or if they don't, you

know, like I don't. Yeah, it's like people, you

know, I'm sure many people have heard this before because it

it's definitely something that is said, at least I've heard a

lot in my life. People can only meet you as deep

of as they've met themselves, right.

So it's like no matter what role they have in your life, it's

people it genuinely. And that's where a lot of like

conflict comes from and anything like that.

But in this specific situation, and I was just asking those

questions because being an adult now, Kaylene, and like you

having kids, if the roles were reversed and say your daughter

was in a position, what would you want for her in that

scenario? Like, so she wasn't alone or

didn't have that feeling or if she was feeling the need to be

that for someone and no matter who it was, what what what

advice would you want to give her that you think could have

been beneficial to you in that season, considering you didn't

really have outer sources to call, you know, other parents,

things like that. It was kind of it was kind of a

land of scarce of it was a. Right, I don't.

Know if I said that correctly, it was like scarce and the land

of what you were living and. Yeah.

And I'm aware of that killing because obviously, like I know

everything, basically not everything, but I know a lot I

should say. So I'm I kind of started this

one by kind of integrating you, but I'm just.

No, no, they're good questions. And honestly, like a lot of

people are in situations like that, whether they realize it,

they don't. You know, some people are in

situations like that, might not realize they are.

But yeah, I guess, I guess too. I would say that it was a lonely

feeling as well because it seems like I was really the only one

that wanted to help them in a sense.

And really and honestly if I could give my little ones advice

it would be don't. Don't ever feel the need to

parent your parent, and don't lose yourself trying to help

somebody that doesn't want help. That's really good.

I really like that and I, you know, it goes so much into, you

know, even through some of my healing, some things that are

highlighted and focused on is OK, if, if you go back to when

you're 6, what would you need in that moment or when the

situation's happening? What do you need in that moment?

And I've, you know, thought about these things a lot.

Definitely. And I've started EMDRI, haven't

been doing it for super long. It took me about a year to get

started. I just had to build a

foundation. But there's just things that

have come up that I'm like, wow, you know, it really kind of

switches my mentality a little bit.

And it does help. And it it really is.

If you look at yourself now and you look back on a situation

example, some of the things we've shared in previous

episodes, if I could be myself now and go sit with my younger

self, I think that I could have made different decisions or I

could have not felt so alone too.

And I think with you killing, if I could be who I am today and

have sat with you through things, I wish I would have had

the capacity and like knowledge that I have now to be able to

have been that person for you back then.

Because it's like looking back, we are born into this family and

to the all of this stuff, all this chaos, all this pain, all

this hurt, all this confusion, and we just didn't have the

capacity to be there for each other.

And I think it's really powerful to be able to sit here at 28 and

29 years old and to be able to have conversations like this.

And also where people are listening to us talking about

it. Because honestly, Kayleen, like

I say it to you over and over again, and I think it all the

time how incredible it is to see where you're at now.

Because there was a point in my life where I was so bitter and

angry. And I've shared that before.

Just some of it. For what I had went through

specifically, but a lot of what I carried was anger for what

happened to you because it it just was never fair to you.

And I know that we I'm like repeating myself from previous

episodes, but it's like, if you could have had someone to just

sit and listen to you as a kid and to see you even when

something happens with your son, I almost was, yeah, saying his

name. And then I was like nephew.

And then I was like, but seeing how you sit and you work through

these emotions and things like that, it's so incredible because

we never had that. And it's just really powerful to

see. And it's it really does go to

show you make your life what you want it to be.

And it's not what you came from. It's not anything like that.

And I think to another powerful thing you're sharing is about

having the desire, right, to save someone that's struggling.

And speaking from my own experience and my struggles, I

had people that were on your side of the fence and it wasn't

family members, like I've said there, we didn't really have a

vast majority of family members that were like, hey, get it

together. Hey, we're here for you.

Hey, you know, if you need anything, call me.

Hey. It just was very far in between

during certain seasons. And a lot of my support has come

from people I've met along my journey.

And in the season where I was struggling the most, I had

someone, like I said, that was like you that did everything and

that sat with me. I was like, I don't know what

else I can do. I've loved you, I've sat with

you and it's still not enough. And it took me hitting rock

bottom and I don't even want to say rock bottom because I feel

like I've hit rock bottom multiple times in my life.

It took me like a life changing experience, like moving across

the country and kind of more like spiritually speaking,

thirsting out here and being scarce and not knowing where I

belong. Like I didn't have any of my

friends, all of that. It took me losing and I'm using

losing. But because I don't want to say

walking away, because I don't walk away from the people,

they're still on this journey with me.

But it took me being alone and being able to really sit with

myself to make changes. And you have to do it.

You have to want it in yourself. You can't.

Somebody can't want it enough for you.

Yeah, and I feel like at a point in time, I was there for so long

and I found myself, it just came to me because I I was like, did

I feel lonely? Like how did I feel at the end

when I finally, right before I had got in court, ordered to

move some somewhere else? Like what was going through my

head? What was going through my head

was I was like, all I did was I was trying to help, but then I

was trying so hard that I eventually started drowning with

that person and I was hurting myself along the way because I

like found myself like in bad situations.

I found myself wanting to, you know, we weren't around the best

people. I was starting to do things that

at my age during that time, no kid should have gotten into.

And that's why I said before I think it was a good thing.

You know, it broke my heart, but I, I started drowning too.

And it's like, you know, trying to pull somebody out of the pool

that's drowning and you eventually get tired and it

weighs down on you and then you start going underwater with

them. And that I feel like that's what

started happening. And I was so young that I was, I

literally had gotten court ordered to move back in with

them. You know, another part, the

other person. And at that time I was so angry.

I was so hurt. I was so, and I know I bring

that up a lot, but that's has a lot to do with a lot of things.

I on what, like what was happening on the other side and

whenever that happened, what why the other things had happened in

that house and stuff like that. Like there's so much that

happened, but I was going to like ask you to and you can you

don't have to answer this or anything.

I was just wondering like how did you feel watching kind of

the same things when you were with whenever you were living

there as well like. With tooth.

How is, how did you Yeah, with toothpaste, like how did, how

was you feeling like was you? Because I mean, I, I feel like

you talked a little like here and there and you know, some

things that happened, but like, I don't think you ever really

spoke about. And you don't have to answer but

like how how you were feeling like.

I know you're obviously confused as you know, a child when stuff

like that's happening, but like, you know, just I know you shared

like when the different, you know, when we were moving around

in the different States and like stuff that happened, you know,

when different areas. But like at the end of it all or

even you know, toward the ending or like how is how is you like

feeling or feeling now or just you know.

So, you know, it takes me back to so many different thoughts

and I'm sure you too. I I don't want to say thoughts.

I'm going to say thoughts and memories because I think both

accumulate with things like this.

I mean, I think when I really started, like looking now at

where I'm at, I think when depression became something in

my life and I didn't know what it was, it just felt heavy was

when we had moved to North Carolina from somewhere.

I, I don't know, I can't, I try to remember, but we had moved

there and shoe or I don't remember if it's sock, a sock

and toothpaste. We're trying to work it out.

And I remember being in a trailer and toothpaste was never

really there and then shoe always stayed in the bathroom.

And now that I'm older, I understand both sides of the

scenario because I went and lived my life and hurt people

that were at home. And also on the other end, I've

been someone in the bathroom where I was too hurt from life

to want to get out of the bathtub.

So I look at it like that and when I, when we start talking

about all this, I think it brings up so many things that

I'm also still working through. And I think it was at that point

in time when I felt toothpaste was and and it was in a very, it

was a glimpse of that time that I felt they were the only one

that cared about us. Because at least even though all

this stuff is happening around us, it makes you feel like at

least this person's there. Like at least this person cares

enough to like, because when you're in someone's presence,

it's so powerful and it's enough to be like, at least I'm not

alone. Even if you feel alone it and

killing. We've said this, we talked about

a time spent with someone has time spent with someone, whether

it's good or bad. And you know, you make these

memories together and you do life together and stuff like

that. But when shoe, I remember when

we had drove back home to a family member's house and we got

sat down, that shoe didn't want to be with us anymore,

basically. And that's when we really got

left in this dynamic. You know, it really sat with me

because that was the second time.

So the first time when she had left, it was in another state

and we got left with toothpaste. And, you know, I think it, it

caused a lot of confusion that I didn't realize until I've gotten

older and started going through healing and therapy and stuff

like that because you don't start like thinking back and

killing me. And you, we do it together all

the time. Even on the podcast, there's

times where we're like, oh, yeah.

And I remember that day, that second time, the first time I

remember it was hard for all of us.

I remember, you know, it, it gives you a, it, it does give

you a sense of abandonment. No matter what the other

person's reasoning is, you're still a child.

And now seeing kids that did get a parent that would never leave

them, that holds their hand through life, it's such a

blessing. And it's literally when I see

that, it's literally like, I want to hold them in my hand and

just a ball and just protect it because it's such a special

thing to have with your parent. And we never had that.

And I just want to make sure that if it's in proximity of my

life, I want to respect it. And I want to just make sure

that I don't do anything in my walk to cause any harm to a

dynamic like that. And it reminds me of these

situations because the first time when she had left, I was

like, I, I was broken. I mean, and we were younger.

So then when we had went to the trailer in North Carolina and it

happens again. It's like, Oh my gosh, you open

up your heart and the person you want is finally there, you know,

and it you're, you're here. And I just, I want you and I

want life with you and I want holidays with you and I want all

these things with you. And we just didn't get that.

And they had left again. And so much happened in between

that. But I remember I used to

toothpaste had like this older car and this was like my stance

that I don't even know if we've talked about before.

Maybe we have, but they had an older car in the driveway.

And I used to just go out there and just scream in the car and

just cry. Like I remember that I would

just snot would just be going down my face and I would do it

all the time. I just was so hurt.

I was like, why? Why leave us?

Why? And not even just, I mean, there

was so much going on around us, but at the same time, this pain

was like of them leaving because then in my head I'm like, when

are we going to see them again? Are they coming back?

Like all of these things. It's like why?

Why? Like what did we do wrong?

Because as a kid, you always, you know, what did I do wrong

and what could I have done better for them to stay like in

all these situations. So as we're going through these

States and these people that toothpaste is meeting and just

people we're encountering, I started getting, I started

getting angry. I feel like my soul started like

shifting into anger instead of because I, I don't feel like I

ever was this like huge walking angry person.

I think life made me angry. And I think there's a lot of

people like that in life where you weren't, you didn't just

come out of the room angry things make you angry.

You know, like if you go through a drive through and someone

forgets your Nuggets that you ordered it, it can cause you to

get angry. And it's like, it's just a it's

an emotion. And I think when so much happens

and like, people get very angry and they don't know what to do

with it because sitting with pain is easy, harder than being

angry about it. Yeah.

It's easier to walk through and just be like, oh, screw this,

whatever. I don't care about this.

I don't care about this. But if you really sit with

yourself, that's why a lot of people can't sit with themselves

because they can't sit with the anger or the pain because it's

too much to deal with. And it really is.

And I'm speaking because I've gone through it and I know, and

that's why I picked up a bottle and the bottom of the bottle was

never deep enough for me. And going through these states

with toothpaste, I feel like I watched.

Not even just watched, but I learned I, you know, I'm humbly

admitting it. I learned manipulation and I

learned how using people. And I don't feel like I carry

that into my life. I think, I think it made me so

on guard of being that way because as we're moving to these

States and we're getting involved in these churches.

I mean, churches are the 1st place you can go to where

there's a lending hand, there's a charity, there's, you know,

however you look at it. But if you're using it as a

clutch to get an upper hand and say you're bouncing around and

each place you're going to, it's another story.

And it's, I started getting bitter and you know, I remember

and one day I actually wrote someone a letter and apologized.

And I just started, I was like, why?

Like, why are you doing this to people?

Why? And I just didn't understand it

at the time. And now that I've like really

started studying, definitely when I moved to Arizona, I

studied so much. Like, I don't even like reading.

I started reading. I wanted to understand what

causes people and it's their pain.

You know, it's what people have had to deal with.

And I'm not pointing out this specific person by any means.

I'm just saying having kids involved in such an intense

dynamic like that where we were getting dragged around with it

and being taught right. And I feel like I just got, I

just started getting better. And then when we got the court

order from Ohio to go back with Shoe, I felt so happy.

And I remember there was one time, I don't know what state we

were in, where we were, but I remember and killing, I'm hoping

you remember this too. But she had, we were in the back

of a car and it was like all three of us girls.

And we were all singing the climb.

And I remember we were crying. We were singing the climb by

Miley Cyrus and we were all crying and we were saying

goodbye to Shoe. Again, I don't remember why or

what was happening, but now every time I hear the song The

Climb by Miley Cyrus. I do remember that.

It's like one of my favorite, but also one of the most

haunting songs of my entire life because of that moment.

And it's like it brings back where are you going?

Like, why are you leaving? Why?

Why can't you just be with us, you know, And then you see all

these other kids who have exactly what you want and it

can't, It does cause you to get jealous at a certain point, for

sure. I think now in my walk, I it's

not jealousy, it's grieving. There's a huge, huge difference

between jealousy and grieving. I think it caused that for me.

But being in the the dynamic with toothpaste, I didn't

really, really start getting angry.

Like I was angry, but when things started happening with

you and then seeing how you didn't have on the flip side

from the other foundation where you should have had help, you

didn't have that either. And I started getting even more

angry. And then, you know, I'm running

my mouth like as a kid and just not like cussing anyone out or

anything like that, just fighting back on something that

was constantly I was punching bag too.

I felt like, and then once I started speaking up, it became,

you know, your mouthy, you're this.

So looking at the situation and what the question that you

specifically asked me, I know I kind of just like went into a

whole thing. It's just so hard because when I

think of one thing, then it's you know, it's like, Oh my gosh,

this led to this and this led to this.

And I think for a lot of years, Kayleen, I just, I don't think

you'll ever understand how much guilt I carried and how many

breakdowns I had at the fact that I didn't stay at that last

house with you because I felt like it was my fault.

Because if I would have just stayed and protected you like

you just never would have. But this goes to say, remember

after the podcast, like a couple times ago, you we were like

talking and you said something about a crystal ball.

You were like, if we could look, I don't remember how you worded

it. It was something like, I know if

you could look into a crystal ball and see it, how life could

have been different if we would have chose differently.

It was like when you had said it and I was like, holy crap, dude,

like. Right and.

Because it's like 1 little decision could have changed

everything, but would it have changed everything?

Right, exactly like, you know, or it could have it's just so

crazy the so many different directions.

And then maybe that one good thing that like changing one

thing so that way it was good could have turned into, you

know, something even worse in the future or where you know,

like, or you know, it's, it's just like I always say,

everything happens for a reason because, you know, sometimes

also I did crap. I was going to ask you something

or oh, I was going to say as as a kid.

I feel like when things are happening as well and you're not

getting answers for anything, you start getting confused.

You have a lot of questions. You, you do start blaming

yourself. You're like, why did this

happen? Yeah, it's like, and then you're

mate, you're like, why, why? You you're, you know, you're

asking why a lot because it's like, why, like, why did this

happen? Why did they leave?

Why didn't they want us? Well, you know what could, what

did I do? Like and then you're blaming

yourself and then you and then you start.

Carrying the weight of that and that parent or whatever.

And you know, as when you speak about toothpaste, I feel like on

the flip side, in the dynamic with shoe, I feel like I wanted

to compensate so much for their pain.

I would, you know, looking back, do I did I make mistakes?

Absolutely. Did I say things I shouldn't

have? Abso freaking lutely I did.

But looking back, I know my heart was in the right place and

I just wanted, like you wanted to compensate for this person.

And on the flip side, I'm over here and I'm going over and

beyond and the way that I know how chores, you know, doing what

I'm supposed to. I would wake up in the winter

every day before school and go shovel the driveway.

That way they could get out, out from the snow.

And I would text, I would text this person every day because

there was 2 ponds on either side of the road at that time.

They'd be safe driving like across the ponds or the road

where the ponds are because I'm worried like if it's icy or

something like that. I was always so scared that they

would fall into the pond. I know that sounds insane, but I

finally got this like grip on what I've always wanted.

And I'm saying grip like I had it in close proximity and I

never wanted to lose it. And that was a relationship with

this person. And in that moment, I felt like

I, my, I felt like my fingertip was touching their sleeve, but

it never was in my head. My fingertip was touching their

sleeve, but it wasn't for them. And I think it takes me back to

like a lot of different things because looking back at what I

let my mentality get to trying to be someone in their life and

then, you know, it takes me to a whole nother Ave. where it's

like thinking of you specifically Kayleen.

It's like you know what's happening and you know the

situation like fight harder and then on the other, not fight

harder. Be I feel like that's not the

right thing to say. Be a parent, be a parent, be a

parent. And not that there was like no

love there or anything like that, but if it was your kids, I

know that me and you would be sitting there and I would

literally go through hell and high water to do anything for

those kids. And I don't care what it is.

So now I go even a little deeper and I think about, OK, then you

bring a another person who has characteristics just in a

different way of where they're doing things physically and

psychologically and it's the same thing.

It's like you chose these people.

And then in the end, we get set, we get sad, and we're the ones

at empty tables. And it's sad to me because you

did everything in your power, lost yourself.

Do am I blaming any of our addictions or anything on

anybody? Absolutely freaking not.

Do I think that coping was a big part of it?

Yeah. Do I think that exposure was a

big part of it? Yes.

Do I think it's the people's fault?

No, I think it's it's it's simply just that exposure and

coping. And so with that, it's, you

know, we lost ourselves and trying to love these people so

much that we were floating in the middle of an ocean and we

didn't even have our own floaties on our arms.

And that's not saying that they didn't do the best they could.

I truly believe that they people around us loved us to their

capacity. Absolutely.

I truly believe that, right. But there's also a line of how

far do you go with your kids? Where where's the line drawn?

You know, it's at a certain point.

It's not about what happened to you.

At a certain point, you, you have to care about the people

around you, even if it's a friend, you know, and I was at a

point before where I couldn't be that person for the people

around me. And I was the one in the pool

drowning them with me, unfortunately.

And I'm just being honest because I, I know I was on both

ends of it and I never want to be the person in the pool again

where I'm dragging someone down. And I just went on a whole, I'm

so sorry. Like, I don't know that just my

brain kind of just went like all over the place so.

No, you're good. Like you made really, really

good points and like, you know, like talking about, you know,

just how you're feeling and stuff because I that's what I

was asking. So you're no like I think

there's just like honestly enough.

There's so much Yeah, I think, and I don't know why this has

been on my mind so heavy. I, I was writing my book and I

like wrote about that dog Dixie that toothpaste had gotten.

And it was like a little mutt dog.

I loved that dog. Like, I love that.

I know when Dixie died. I know I, I think that's why I,

I love Drake so much, because I Drake's my dog.

I have a boxer and he's sick. He's got his lovers failing and

all these things. Whatever.

But I'm going to do whatever I can.

That dog's going to live as long as he possibly can.

I do not care. But yeah, you know, that sock

had just left. And then I get home one day and

I'm told that one of my friends that hung out with in the

trailer park killed my dog. And I'm like, then I'm like, you

know what? I don't care about anything.

I was like, yeah, this person left.

Everything going on over on this side with toothpaste is just

like chaos. I don't even know what's

happening anymore. And then someone killed my dog

like. In the moment I was like.

I I remember standing outside and I built like a little grave

site for Dixie and I made a cross and I put it on top and it

was snowing. I almost want to say it was

Christmas, but I don't want to say that without like having

like it being factual. But yeah, it was something.

I almost think it was Christmas because I remember how sad I was

and I was thinking in my head, but I was like standing there by

myself and come to find out. You know, I'm still hanging out

with that friend. And I'm like, how is this person

hanging around me knowing that they killed my dog?

Like, how do you do that? And.

I. What?

I was just going to say real quick, I just feel so bad for

you because when I look at you and whenever I see like little

agent Adrian version of you all, like genuinely all you wanted

was love like and it's so sad. Like I, it's, it's really,

really sad like. I'm such a.

Baby, you done. No, like you, you, you really

did. Like I remember you, even if it

was before school, like you would if you were asked, you

would have made breakfast for everybody.

You cleaned all this. I I remember you cleaning a lot.

Like a lot. You were always, always, always

cleaning or like doing something or or mowing the yard or

shoveling snow or just just like wanted that like you did a good

job. Like, thank you or, you know,

just someone, like it makes me tear up too, because I, I, I,

when I think of the times when you were younger, like that's

really what you did most of the time, like.

I didn't want to. I don't think anybody wants to.

And I can say the same for you, Kayleen, in different ways

because we do have like different interests and stuff,

obviously. But like you too, you know, it's

I'm really so glad for who we are as people today because we

didn't let we may we have gotten bitter at points, yeah.

And angry, yeah, but I don't think all of us wanted to be

angry. And I, you know, I I really

don't feel. Do I think we made mistakes as

kids? Yeah.

I mean, every child is going to. You have to learn somehow, some

way, whatever. But do I feel like we were

trashing the house and throwing parties and all this stuff?

No. Like were we exposed in certain?

Things. In which we can get into that

later, but that was my breaking point was when Dixie got killed

and I ended up asking my friend, I'm like, did you did you tell

my dog? Like how do you run over my dog

and not tell me? And she looked at me and she's

like Adrian, she said the name, but she's like toothpaste.

I watched toothpaste run over your dog and I was like, what?

I'm like, are you kidding me? Like it was one of the worst

moments of my life. And I say that, but I can say

that about a lot of things. But I named Dixie Dixie because

of the movie, because of 1 Dixie.

And I have not watched that movie one time since because it

was so hard for me when Dixie died because I, I don't know why

Dixie dying like hit me so hard. And I don't know why it's

something that keeps coming up in my mind.

I'm like, why am I still grieving a dog?

Like I think that at that point in our lives.

Kayleen Sock went missing twice now and I say went missing

because to us that's what it was.

And their perspective, it could have looked.

Obviously they have their reasoning, but to us, this

person's missing and we don't know when we're going to see

them again. And when you're left with a

thought like that, anyone that has that thoughts, I I feel for

them because it's the worst feeling in the world.

And then, you know, like I said, living in this dynamic, and then

Dixie always followed me. You know, a dog teaches you so

much about life that people don't realize.

Unconditional love. They're always by you no matter

what and all these things. And yeah, I think at that time

in my life, like, Dixie was a rock for me in a sense, even

though I was like, a little kid. But yeah, when Dixie died, I

think I was just like, man, what the heck is happening?

Yeah, You always had like a closer relationship to the dogs

and animals then. Like you were really the one

that would, like, feed them and yeah, like I loved that like,

like having dogs and puppies and stuff like that or whatever

animal we had at that time. Hamster, turtle, you know, But

I. Kind of share a story real

quick. OK, I had a bearded dragon and I

love the spirit of dragon. Like I would sleep with her on

my shoulder. I really took care of it, you

know, I've had it. It was I loved the spirit of

dragon and Kayleen and someone else that was in the house

called me and like tried pranking me and was like,

Brody's legs all fell off. I'm like, what?

I was freaking out literally about to cry.

And then they told me it was a prank.

And I'm like, Oh my gosh, you guys suck.

And then one day Brody, like wouldn't wake up.

And Kayleen, I'm like, literally on the verge of losing it.

I think my bearded Dragon's dead.

Kelly decides to start poking it with a stick.

I'm like, there are two different types of people in the

world. And then Brody was fine.

I'm like, what made you think that this bearded dragon was

dead? And your first thought is to

poke it with. But yeah, I do feel like, you

know, I I love animals a lot. And then, you know, even in the

dynamic with when we got older and the way that one of the

people in our lives like would punch him in the face and stuff

used to really be a lot for me. And it it made me question a lot

with other parents. I guess I don't know how to word

it. So it just when someone's,

there's so much that goes into that because it's like, what are

they going through? What are they dealing with and

behind the scenes, whatever. But going back to your original

question, how I felt going through the States and all that,

I became better. I became ashamed.

I felt a lot of shame when we were going to these states

because you Start learning a pattern.

And I just feel like I became so shameful myself because I felt

like we were a part of the decisions because we were, we

weren't driving the car, but we were in the backseat.

And so we're in it and it's a reflection of the car.

You know what I'm saying? And when these things started

happening and you Start learning these patterns, I started going

into it with like, Oh my gosh, I'm so embarrassed and I feel so

much shame. And you know, people, I remember

one time some church people bought us a ton of groceries.

And I remember feeling so guilty because do you remember that?

I remember it myself. I felt so much guilt and shame.

I was like, I was like sitting. I don't think, I don't think

there was a couch at that time. I might be wrong.

I can't remember. I just remember there was like a

pole in the middle of the room or something like that.

The beam anyways, and it was in. I don't want to say it out.

I don't want to say that exact. Tone.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I just remember feeling a lot of shame and guilt killing I that's

the only way I can explain it. I felt I just felt really

embarrassed and I feel like I. But I do remember what you're

talking about. Yeah, I do remember.

It was just embarrassing at a certain point, even though they

didn't see it what was actually going on because like, how are

they going to have knowledge of everything behind but.

Yeah. I just really started hating

myself. I didn't want to be in it.

I, I really started just hating myself and I hated that, you

know, we were a part of it. Yeah, yeah, I did want to ask

you one other thing as well. Like if you could go, if you

could go back in time, like any certain time, any period of

time, and you were able to tell yourself one thing like now,

like you now tell yourself one thing like whenever you were

younger, what, what would you, what do you think you would tell

your younger self like? You know, if I could be, if I

could be me going to any point of time, honestly and say I

think I would have felt comfort. And as much as I hated hearing

it growing up because I don't know about you, but I feel like

every person was like it's going to be OK.

It's going to be OK. It's going to be OK.

And it's like you're not. What do you mean it's going to

be OK? Like you're you don't know

what's happening or you do know what's happening.

Nobody's doing anything like I hated hearing it's going to be

OK. I started despising when someone

would say that to me and I started getting so angry anytime

someone said it. So then I just stopped talking

for a long time because I was like, it's going to be OK, It's

going to be OK. And it's like all these things.

And but now I would sit with myself and I would say it's

going to be OK because every single thing that happened, it's

going to be OK. Are you going to have a little

bit of trauma? A little bit?

Are you going to have trauma and baggage and things like that?

Absolutely. But at the end of the day, it's

going to be OK. And you're going to find

yourself sitting in a state where you built your life.

I would just, it's making me tear up.

I'm such a freaking crybaby. But I would say, what would you

say day or Saturday? Not well, not we talked about it

a little, but yeah, I genuinely, that's so that's so sweet.

Like that's sweet how you explained it and stuff.

But it's true because hearing it from your future self like is so

different than hearing it from people that either don't know

the situation, they don't they're not like wanting to

understand or they don't get it or whatever.

Like, you know, hearing it from you, from the future would be

like, OK, OK, I don't know how or when it will be, but at least

one day. I know you know.

I feel like being at this bright age of 28, that was my leg.

But I definitely feel sometimes with where I'm at mentally, with

how much has happened in life, I struggle because you know,

people are still going out and going out on the weekends and to

bars and stuff like that. But I live that all I wanted,

and I'm at a point in my life where I just want peace and I

just want family. And, you know, I have someone, I

have people that have stepped into a role that they have no

obligation to. And they've sat with me through

some pretty serious triggers. And you know, I know in my heart

that it's not easy walking through even just a present day

situation with someone that has these immense amount of like

barriers, triggers, reservations.

It's not easy. And I'm very grateful for the

people that have had patience and that have gotten brought

into my life that have had that patience because all it takes is

one person. It really does.

So when you're saying that about toothpaste, I can see why you're

saying that because it just takes one person to just simply

be like, I'm here and I love you, and sometimes it's not and

sometimes it's not. Yeah.

And I hate to say it like that, but sometimes it's just not.

And some, but I'm also realizing too, sometimes it's not about

the other people and it's about you and seeing what you've done

with your life. It it was never about the other

person. It was everything to do with

you, Kayleen. You didn't realize it like.

Going through all that, but I mean, life could have taken so

many different turns and look at where you're at.

It was never, it was never about anybody else or I'm so big on

this now. It's not about what's happening

around you. How are you going to react?

You're always going to have stuff happening around you,

work, friends, whatever. There's always going to be

something happening. How are you going to react and

what are you going to do about it?

And I say that because I've, I've really let my reaction

spiral in the past, like getting a DUI and wrecking 5 cars and

stuff like that, which, you know, like I've said, I'll talk

more about later. But it really hit me, you know,

when you were talking about saving and like wanting to be

that person because I remember there was one night when I was,

I was just Downing the alcohol and you know what, there was a

lot of my a lot of years look like that.

I just, I would get off work. I would even going to work drunk

first thing I did stop by the liquor store, open something and

I would just drink all night. And it was just a repetitive

thing. I just couldn't be without a

drink in my hand. Like people who know me back

then wouldn't recognize me today.

I don't feel like because I always had a drink in my hand

and that's just who I was, you know, I was out.

And I'm so proud of you, though. I just become a long way, you

know? Killing There was one night when

I was standing in the kitchen. I remember I was like Downing

the liquor and I started bawling and I was like, I became exactly

what I don't want to be like. I loved the I loved that house

that day because I didn't want anything to do with it.

And I became exactly what I walked away from.

Like I remember that night, that night specifically, I was drunk.

I hadn't blocked out yet. I was drunk.

And I just remember I literally told my friend, I'm like, I, I

became the person that I didn't want to be like.

And here I am standing here drunk.

All I do is drink. I'm always blocking out.

I'm I became them. Like how did I get here?

Yeah, And then there and then there was also a night where you

said enough is enough. I can't live like this and I

don't want to live like this. And you made a change, and

that's because. And you did that for you, like

you did that on your own all by yourself.

Like I'm sure you. I know you've had help.

I know you. I know you have a very good

support system, but you did that.

That support system you have you created.

And so did you, Kaylene, Don't be mistaken.

I know. Our lives look very.

Different. No, I'm crying.

This is like, you know and this goes.

Yeah. And I'm not going to pressure

you to talk about anything obviously, but because I feel

like when you know, normally guys, when we're we start the

podcast, like the first hour, it takes killing till the 2nd hour

to like start. Yeah, I know.

Yeah. And.

Then we always talk after the podcast and we're like, dude, we

should be ignoring. Right now I know, right?

Every time I, I know there was definitely a point in time in my

life where it wasn't necessarily like drinks that I was numb in

the pain with, but I, I did the same thing and I went down a

very, very, very bad Rd. like a very bad road.

And I didn't, I didn't think I was going to get out of it.

Like I thought I thought that too.

I was going to be, you know, for the rest, not really the rest of

my life because I knew that's not what I wanted.

But I just any like anything that would numb the pain and I

didn't like have to feel her or pain or sad.

Like I wouldn't say it was the one thing, like one specific

thing. It kind of was a mixture.

I was just partying a lot, you know, going to parties and yeah,

like, you know, there's somebody walking around the party, they

open their hand and they said it was just a bunch of different

things. And I just grabbed one and put

it in my mouth. Like I didn't know.

Like they, well, they obviously said it's this business.

And then I just grabbed one and. It's like a.

Yeah, yeah. And so I definitely had like my

own. See, but on the flip side, then

it's like when you go to ask for help even from the other side.

So everyone has two parents, guys, I don't know if you knew

that, but you go to the other side.

So you go to the other side and there's just multiple different

ways that it could go. So with that, we are going to

conclude this episode and we are so excited to see you guys for

the next one because we are going video.

So see you guys in the next one. You guys will get to see us for

the first time and we are so excited to start this next part

of the journey with you. We are going to be on YouTube as

well. So our YouTube page is

officially up. Also, ashes became altars and

we're excited to get more engaged and just get to know you

guys as we do this as well. All right, guys, we will talk to

you all soon.

The briefing